回忆一下我们讲到哪里了 So just to remind us where we are
周一我讲到了出埃及记第12章 On Monday we spoke about Exodus 12
以及圣经里面关于 and the Biblical requirements
逾越节羔羊的要求 for the paschal lamb
我讲了这些内容 which I unpack some of that
以逾越节家宴的概念结束 I ended with the notion of Seder
我会从上次 So I'm gonna pick up
结束的地方继续讲 exactly where I left off
就是我对逾越节家宴的定义 So here is my definition of a Seder
和周一给大家的 which is exactly the same
讲义上面提到的 with what was on the handout
是完全一致的 for Monday's lecture
我的主要观点是 And my big point was that
在出埃及记第12章和其他章节中 In Exodus 12 and other passages
可以看到逾越节仪式的 We do see educational function
教育功能 of the paschal ritual
也就是如果你的孩子问你X In which if your child ask you X
你要回答Y then you should say Y
以及一系列的段落 and a whole series of such passages
我不太确定 I'm not quite sure
这些在原始的语境中 what that would have meant
是什么意思 in its original context
或者这些应该 Or how this was meant to
怎么样被执行 have been performed
从这些段落里面 And it is out of these passages
随后演化出来逾越节家宴 that Seder will later on emerge
但是我不认为圣经 But I don't think the Biblical text
此时已经知道会有 is yet aware of what will
以后人们所谓的逾越节家宴 come to be called a Seder
这就是我的观点 Alright, that was my point
大家可以不同意 Feel free to disagree
但是这就是我的观点 But that's what I am gonna argue
所以咱们再来讨论下什么是逾越节家宴 So let's discuss again what a Seder is
这就是我们今天要讨论的内容 That's what we are gonna discussing today
什么的逾越节家宴 What is the Passover Seder
我们会简单对比下 And we'll look again briefly at
逾越节家宴和圣经中内容的差别 how it compares to the Biblical material
以及在拉比犹太教中是如何发展的 and how it developed in rabbinic Judaism
逾越节家宴 So, Seder
Seder这个词是个普通的希伯来词 The word Seder is just a normal Hebrew word
是顺序 安排的意思 which means order, or arrangement
这是一顿饭 对吧 So it is a meal eaten, right?
所以是在饭桌边完成的 It is done at the table
是在吃饭中完成的 so, it's done over a meal
所以涉及到了食物 So there's food involved
同时还是一种仪式 And it's a ritual
不只是吃食物 You don't just eat the food
还有一系列相关的如何吃食物的仪式 there's whole ritual attached to how it is eaten
食物要怎么样吃 and the way in which it is eaten
是在逾越节的第一天晚上实施 Performed on the first night of Passover
尼散月的第15天 还记得吗 15th of Nisan, remember that?
尼散月第14天的傍晚 So the 14th of Nisan at dusk
第15天的开始 turns in to the 15th
什么是尼散月 What is Nisan?
我想我上次用过这个词 I used the word in some last time, I think I did
为什么没有人问我呢 So why hasn't someone asked me right away?
什么是尼散月 What is Nisan?
尼散月是 Nisan is the
后圣经时代对希伯来日历中 a post-Biblical name of the first month
第一个月的叫法 是在春天 in the Hebrew Jewish calendar, in the spring
在希伯来圣经里面 In Hebrew Bible
尼散月这个词没有出现过 the word Nisan does not appear, okay?
这是后圣经时代 This is the post-Biblical name
对第一个月的叫法 是在春天 for the first month, the spring month
而出埃及记里面是叫第一个月 whereas Exodus 12 calls the first month
最后被叫做 This comes to be called
尼散月 the month of Nisan
明白了吧 Okay?
不要拼成尼桑汽车那个词 Not spell the way the carmaker
尼桑是两个S 尼散月是一个S That is two S's, this is one S
尼散月的第15天 So the 15th day of Nisan, right?
第14天的傍晚 The 14th at dusk
然后我们会执行这些仪式 Then we have this luandus ritual is performed
其中包括象征性的食物 And it consists of symbolic food
什么是象征性的食物 What is symbolic food, class?
我先澄清下 I'll make it clear
食物不是象征性的 食物是真的 The food is not symbolic, the food is real
或者说我们吃食物 Or we are eating real food
不是为了其营养价值 not for its nutritive value
也不是为了五花八门的口味 not for its peak count array of flavor
而是因为被吃的食物 Rather the food is eaten because
象征着什么 it symbolizes something
代表着什么 it represents something
比如说 So for instance
苦草 Bitter herbs
苦草 没错 Bitter herbs, right
我们在逾越节家宴吃苦草 We eat bitter herbs at the Seder
因为苦草可以提醒我们 Because the bitter herbs remind us
象征着 代表着那些回忆 symbolize, represent recall to mind, right?
以色列人曾经 The bitterness of the Israelites
在埃及为奴的辛酸 in Egypt in slavery
所以在密西拿里面 我们随后还会讲到 So the Mishnah, as we'll discuss in one second
有一系列象征性的食物 has an array of symbolic food
你可以争论说 And one could argue
圣经里面提到了苦草 Scripture itself refers to bitter herbs
但是圣经没有解释 But the Scripture itself does not explain
为什么要 why you would want to eat
把逾越节羔羊和苦草一起吃 the paschal lamb with the bitter herbs
但是这是圣经再一次为我们 But that again, is this Scripture warrant
有象征性的食物做了证明 for the idea that we have symbolic food
也就是说食物代表着什么 i.e., foods that represent something
食物不是表面看起来的食物 Foods that are not what they appear
看起来我是在吃辣根 It looks like I'm eating a piece of horseradish
但是实际上我吃辣根 but it's true, but the horseradish that I'm eating
我会吃辣根只是因为它提醒了我 I'm eating only because it reminds me
通过吃辣根让我想起了 By eating it, it helps bring to mind
我们的祖先在埃及所经历的那些苦难 suffering the bitterness of our ancestors in Egypt
在逾越节 逾越节家宴上 Okay, now on the Passover, a Seder
有很多象征性的食物 there are a bunch of symbolic foods
这些食物会被摆在 and they will ultimately come to be arranged
我们叫做家宴板的上面 in what's called the Seder plate
这是一张不错的家宴板的照片 And here is a lovely photo of a Seder plate
他们在中间放了一杯酒 These people put a cup of wine in the middle
这不是必须的 which is not required
但是在照片里面看效果不错 But it looks nice on the photo
里面有典型的六样 So here you have typically six
一 二 三 四 五 六 One, two, three, four, five, six
六个小碗 杯子 Six little bowls, cups
这取决于你买的家宴板 It depends on how fancy schmancy
有多华丽 you bought a Seder plate
可以用79美分就买到一个塑料的 You can get a little plastic one, It's 79 cents
或者也可以 Or you can get one
买一个被艺术家装饰得很华丽的 which is done by a fancy schmancy artist
有镀金 有镶嵌的家宴板 which gold gilt, and inlay
这取决于你想要什么样的 You know, it depends on what you want
照片里面这个看起来介于二者之间 This one looks like an in-between one
总之回到我们的重点 Anyway, back to the subject matter at hand
这是一个摆好的家宴板 So here we have an arrange of a Seder plate
我会快速讲一下 We will do a quick tour
家宴板上都有什么东西 of what you have on the Seder plate
一般来说家宴板会放到 which is typically placed
饭桌的中间 in the middle of the table
包括一些象征性的食物 and it contains the symbolic foods
有一些是吃的 Some of them are eaten
有一些不会吃 Some of them are not eaten
只是用来看的 We just look at them
可以提醒我们很多东西 to remind us of various things
有一盘是绿叶菜 So here we have some green leafy things
为什么要吃绿叶菜 Why do we eat green leafy things?
因为是春天 所以我们吃一些绿叶 Because it's spring, we eat green leafy things
这是前菜 It's an orderve
但是我没有太好的解释 But I don't have a good explanation for that
他们用的似乎是欧芹 So these people seem to use parsley
对吧 在我们家会用西芹 Right? In my family we use celery
有些人会用土豆 Some people use potato
有一些绿叶食物 Okay, so you have some green leafy things
没什么象征意义 Not very symbolic
像我说的 可能是因为春天来了 Like I said, maybe it's spring
这是盐水 Here is salt water
盐水 代表着 Salt water, representing the tears
以色列奴隶的眼泪 of the Israelite slaves
还有苦草 Here we have bitter herbs
看起来像是圆形的辣根 This looks like round horseradish
不应该用罐装的这种 Shouldn't use the kind from the jar
但是没关系 But okay
他们用的罐装的这种 They use the kind from the jar
可以看到辣根 So you see horseradish
为什么 因为辣根是苦的 Why? Cos horseradish is bitter
是苦的 is bitter
这可能是他们的Haroset This is probably their Haroset
也就是密西拿里面提到的 Which is a, mentioned in the Mishnah
一种罗马风格的蘸料 Which is a Roman style dipping sauce
如果你问象征意义是什么 What is the symbolic of, you say
密西拿没有解释过 Well, the Mishnah does not explain
但是上过希伯来学校的孩子都知道 But every Hebrew school child knows
Haroset代表着 that Haroset represents
以色列人在用灰泥 some water of the Israelites
做砖块时候用的水 working with mortar and brick
这代表着水 So this represents them water
是一种罗马色拉调味料 It's a Roman salad dressing, right
然后是两种熟食 Then we have two cooked foods
一种是胫骨 This is a shank bone over here
还有一只烤蛋 And this is a roast egg
我们不吃胫骨 We don't eat the shank bone
但是要在桌子上摆上胫骨 But we have the shank bone on the table
来让我们回忆起逾越节祭品 to remind us of the paschal sacrifice
我们的祖先曾经 that our ancestors used to bring
带到耶路撒冷神庙的那些 in the Temple in Jerusalem
还有一只烤蛋 Then we have a roast egg
我不太确定 I'm not always quite sure
为什么要有一只烤蛋 why we have a roast egg
有一些很复杂的解释 A lot of complicated explanations
我不打算细讲 which I won't go into
但是在家宴板上 But we have two cooked foods
有两种熟食 on the Seder plate
一种是胫骨 One is the shank bone
肯定是代表着逾越节祭品 It definitely represents the paschal sacrifice
现在已经没有了 which we no longer have
所以用胫骨来提醒自己 So we just have a shank bone to remind us
我们过去曾经的日子 some dark which we used to have
还有另外一种烤的食物 鸡蛋 And now we have another roast food, an egg
我在网上还找到了另外一张 Alright, I also have on the webpage
家宴板的照片 a different Seder plate
就是这张 There we go
不太相同 A different view
食物的摆放方式不同 like a different arrangement of the foods
和我们家一样 在他们家 Here like me, they have celery
用的是西芹 in their house, in their family
而不是绿色的欧芹 instead of the green parsley stuff
看上去他们还有 Here they have Roman lettuce
罗马莴苣 it looks like over here
然后是两种熟食 Here the two cooked foods
胫骨 鸡蛋 Shank bone, egg
还有Haroset Here is that Haroset
罗马色拉调味料 Roman salad dressing
而且看起来用的 And this looks like also
也是罐装辣根 horseradish from the jar
不过用的是红色的辣根 Instead they have the red horseradish
如果你家的习惯不同 没关系 Okay, if your family does it differently, fine
我不是想认可某种习俗 I'm not endorsing any custom here
我只是在描述 I'm just describing whatever pictures
在网上找到的照片 I can find on the web
好了 这就是象征性的食物 Okay, that's symbolic food
大家明白什么是象征性的食物了吗 You understand what symbolic food means then?
记住这些 同学们 Okay, keep this in mind, class
下周当我们讲到圣餐的时候 when we discuss the Eucharist next week
基督徒吃的是面包 When Christians are eating bread
又不是面包 It's not bread
喝的是酒 又不是酒 and drinking wine, it's not wine
好吧 Okay
[阿拉姆语] Okay, what I just mumble
我刚才嘟囔什么呢 I mumble some Aramaic you can pay attention
我嘟囔了几句阿拉姆语好让你们注意听 Okay, so
好了 Symbolic food, that's symbolic foods
象征性的食物 这就是象征性的食物 So we have symbolic foods that we eat
有一些象征性的食物我们会吃 They are foods on the plate that we eat
我们会吃家宴板的上的一些食物 and some foods we just look at
还有一些食物只是用来看的 Because they'll remind us, they evoke
因为这可以提醒我们 唤醒我们 They represent something, okay?
代表着什么 对吧 Then we also have real food
我们还有真正的食物 What is real food?
什么是真正的食物 A meal, alright?
一顿晚餐 对吧 Passover Seders are famous for
逾越节家宴以 stuffing yourself, right?
吃撑你自己著称 对吧 It's part of the experience of Passover Seder
这是逾越节家宴体验的一部分 You can't finish until you ate a my gefilte fish
不吃完我的鱼丸冻就不算完 Right, and until you have various courses
直到吃完每一道菜 Okay, so it's real food
这是真正的食物 Ritualized gestures
仪式化的手势 Ritualized gestures
仪式化的手势 Well, they have the whole series
有一系列 of different customs
不同习惯的 or ritualized gestures
仪式化手势 the simplest gesture is pointing
最简单的手势是指 Right, we pick up the matzah
拿起一块无酵饼 A piece of matzah
一块无酵饼 We pick up the cup of wine
拿起一杯酒 at various moments in the proceedings
在进程当中的不同时刻 We point at the bitter herbs
指向苦草 Okay? If you belong to Christian church
如果你去的是基督教会 were you going to sacrifice the host
你准备献祭圣饼 In many churches
在很多教堂 They pick it up and show the congregation
会拿起圣饼展示给大家 That's a ritualized gesture
这是仪式化的手势 Pick up the wine, you pick up the host
拿起酒 拿起圣饼 Okay, that would be ritualized gesture
这样是仪式化的手势 Well we have that at the Passover Seder
在逾越节家宴里面也有这些 Ritualized speech
仪式化的对话 Prophecies, questions and answers, benedictions
预言 问题和答案 赐福 plates, different Jesus' narrative
家宴板 各种耶稣的故事 That's say we have a scripted text
我们有一个脚本 Right, we are talking
我们的对话 but it's not a freeform talking
不是自由发挥 we have script
我们有脚本 We have text in front of us that we follow
我们根据眼前的脚本 in order and we say certain things
说一些已经写好了的 as they are prescribed for us
特定的对话 Right, these consist of questions and answers
包括问题和答案 which we'll see in a moment
我们会很快讲到 Benedictions, what's a benediction?
赐福 什么是赐福 Blessing?
祝福 Blessings, right
祝福 没错 This is a, ten second digression
说句题外话 One very peculiar thing about Jewish theology
犹太人神学里面非常特别的一点是 is that we, we meaning we humans
我们 我们是指人类 bless God
祝福上帝 Which of course is entirely counterintuitive
这当然是完全违反直觉的 Cos, shouldn't be God blessing us, u-s
因为不应该是上帝祝福我们吗 Well, maybe
也许 Except that rabbinic liturgy, Jewish liturgy
除了拉比礼拜仪式 犹太人的礼拜仪式 we are blessing God
我们祝福上帝 Blessing our O Lord
祝福我们的耶和华 or praise, perhaps you might say
或者你可能会想说是赞美 O Lord, our God, King of Universe, who X
耶和华 我们的上帝 宇宙之王 什么什么 So we bless God
我们祝福上帝 Okay, just a interesting part
这很有趣 I don't have time to deal with that
但是没时间讲 But that's, something very profound
这是很深奥的 and interesting is going on there
很有趣的东西 That's the standard feature of rabbinic liturgy
这是拉比礼拜仪式的基本功能 What does liturgy mean?
Liturgy是什么意思 Liturgy?
Liturgy Rites
仪式 Yes, standardized service, right
是的 标准化的仪式 I guess the service of worship
崇拜的仪式 Fancy word is liturgy
华丽的说法就是Liturgy Why didn't you ask when I use this word
我用这个词的时候你们怎么不问 Bob, it's all of you
Bob 你应该问的 Okay, benedictions
赐福 Praise, just praise of God
赞美 就是赞美上帝 That sort of understandable
这很容易理解 Scriptural exegesis
圣经解读 We know what that is
我们知道这是什么 We've seen that
我们见过的 You quote Scripture and interpret it
引用圣经并解读 And narrative, story-telling
还有叙事 讲故事 These are different forms of
这些是逾越节家宴 the ritualized speech in the Seder
不同形式的仪式化的对话 Okay, in the book that we use
都写在了我们用的书里面 it's called the Haggadah
这本书叫做哈加达 That's the book you get, right
这就是你需要用的书 You get it for free
可以免费得到 If you go to a big supermarket at Passover time
如果是逾越节期间到大超市去 In the Passover section
在逾越节分区 they'll have stacks of Haggadahs
会有堆积如山的哈加达 And again, or you can spend a lot of money
你也可以花一些钱 to get an illustrated one
买一本有插图的 scholarly one, there's all kinds of things
学术性质的 各种版本都有 Okay, that's the book
这就是哈加达 Okay, question on these terms
关于这部分的问题 Just so we know what we are talking about
需要知道我们说的是什么 Haggadah, Seder, bitter herbs, wine
哈加达 逾越节家宴 苦草 酒 Then we understand what we are talking about
然后我们就能明白说的是什么了 Yes, questions?
有问题吗 Okay, then we got to launching to my lecture
咱们继续讲课 The first word is Mishnah
第一个词是密西拿 Before I say anything else
在我开始讲之前 Somebody remind me what the Mishnah is
谁能告诉我什么是密西拿 Yes, what's your name?
请说 你叫什么名字 Brandon
Brandon
Yes
是的 Brandon, what's the Mishnah?
Brandon 什么是密西拿 It's a rabbinic book from the 2nd century CE
是公元二世纪的一本拉比书 that deals with rituals and legalities
主要是关于仪式 合法性 and laws of
还有律法 Good, I'll take it
很好 我同意 That's great, great
非常好 非常好 Rabbinic, it's a book, it's a rabbinic book
拉比 这是一本书 拉比书 and was written in Hebrew
希伯来语写成 from the 2nd century CE
来自公元二世纪 dealing mostly with the legal, rituals, laws
大部分关于法律 仪式 律法 customs, behaviors and the like
习俗 举止 诸如此类 Okay, we read a piece of Mishnah
我们读过一点密西拿 you'll recall about Shabat, from chapter 7
回想下安息日 第七章 Mishnah Shabat chapter 7
密西拿安息日第七章 of the 39 prohibited labors, right?
39条劳作禁忌 对吧 That's a typical piece of Mishnah
这是密西拿的典型段落 A list of things you should, should not do
一个你可以做 不可以做的事情的清单 Okay, that's the Mishnah
这就是密西拿 Good, so it's around the same time
很好 它出现的时间和 with our friend Justin Martyr
我们的朋友殉道士犹斯丁差不多 Justin Martyr is writing around what year?
殉道士犹斯丁在什么时间写作 160, give or take
公元160年左右 Mishnah is presumably taking shape around then
密西拿也是大概那个时间成形 Cos the book seems to emerge
因为这本书似乎是在 at the end of the 2nd century
公元二世纪末出现的 around the year 200
大概是公元200年左右 So this seems to be taking shape
所以基本是在同一个 around the same time
时间形成的 Okay? Good
对吧 很好 That was a quick review, good
这是个快速复习 很好 All of you knew that, right?
你们都知道的 对吧 Just he has his hand raised first
只是他先举手了 But all of you could have answered that, right?
但是你们都知道答案 对吧 Yep
是的 Okay, moving along
好的 继续 So the first time we see black on white
我们第一次有了白纸黑字 Clearly, unambiguously, right
清楚地 不含糊地 对吧 A Passover Seder is in the Mishnah
密西拿里面的逾越节家宴 Tractate Pesahim
逾越节分册 Pesahim is Passovers
Pesahim就是逾越节的 Tractate Pesahim 10
逾越节分册第10章 And right here on your handout
就在你们的讲义上 on your lecture handout
在你们的讲义上 I have completely provided you
我给你们提供了完整的 Mishnah Pesahim 10, okay
密西拿逾越节第10章 But we don't have time to
我们没有时间 read through the whole thing
整个都读一遍 and discuss the whole thing
整个都讨论一遍 So we are gonna focus on the big points
所以我们专注于重点 But here we have Mishnah Pesahim 10
密西拿逾越节第10章 the text in the Mishnah
密西拿中的章节 So, let's see around the year 200 CE
在公元200年左右出现 I see very clearly, unambiguously
非常清楚 不含糊 I don't have to say surely
我不会说肯定 cos it's right here on the page
因为就在这里写着 a Passover Seder
逾越节家宴 Let's look at the main features
我们来看看逾越节家宴的 of the Passover Seders
主要特征 So about lecture handout
在讲义上 I have here these bullet points
我列出来这些要点 Which I'm focusing on these, on these points
我会主要讲这些要点 Sometimes I'll jump back and forth
有些时候可能会 from the bullet points here
离开这些要点 to the texts in the Mishnah Pesahim 10
说一说密西拿逾越节第10章 First bullet point
第一个要点 Four cups of wine
四杯酒 Where do you see that in the Mishnah?
在密西拿哪章可以看到 The Mishnah will tell you right away
密西拿一开始就会告诉你 in the very first paragraph
就在第一段 Excuse me
抱歉 Even the poorest in Israel must not
就算是以色列最穷的人 eat until reclining on his sofa
也不可以吃撑得站不起来 and they, disbursers of charity
而那些施善者 give him not less than four cups of wine
要给他们不少于四杯酒 Even the poorest person in Israel
就算是以色列最穷的人 needs to have four cups of wine
也需要喝四杯酒 And the town, the Father needs to
而城邦的主人需要保证 see to it that even the poorest people
就算是以色列最穷的人 can get four cups of wine
也能得到四杯酒 Whereas the historian types from Italy are intrigue
意大利的历史书很混乱 Where these four cups of wine come from?
四杯酒是从哪里来的 Where does wine come from?
酒是从哪里来的 I know, I comes from grapes, I know
我知道 是从葡萄酿的 我知道 But where is the requirements
但是对于酒的要求 of wine come from?
是从哪里来的 Does the Torah in Exodus 12 mentioned wine
出埃及记第12章的Torah提到了 in connection with the paschal sacrifice?
酒和逾越节祭品的联系了吗 The answer is
答案是 no
没有 So Bahr mentioned this briefly in article
Bahr在他的文章中简单提到过 It's an interesting question
这是个有趣的问题 Where does the custom of wine come from?
这些关于酒的习俗是哪里来的 The obvious answer is
比较明显的答案是 Cos the ancient Israel
因为古代以色列人 Judea, later Palestina, right?
犹大地区 后来的巴勒斯坦 is located in a wine belt
是在葡萄酒的地带上 As you know, all the world cultures
你知道的 世界文化 can be divided up into beer belt
可以划分成啤酒地带 and wine belt
和葡萄酒地带 Right, so the Greek classical cultures
所以希腊的古典文化 wine cultures
是葡萄酒文化 Italy is wine, Greece is wine
意大利是葡萄酒文化 希腊是葡萄酒文化 Ancient Israel is wine, okay
古代以色列是葡萄酒文化 Beer, Egypt is beer
啤酒 埃及是啤酒文化 Mesopotamian civilizations are beer
美索不达米亚文明是啤酒文化 Right, the choice between growing grain
是在种植谷物和葡萄酒 or growing wine, growing grapes
种植葡萄之间选择 Grapes grow in aisles, right
葡萄是一排一排种的 对吧 Those cultures seems to go together
这些文化似乎也是这样 So this is a country of viticulture
所以这是栽培葡萄的国家 So I'm not surprised they are drinking wine
所以他们会喝葡萄酒就一点都不奇怪了 Makes a lot of sense
非常讲得通 However we are not just drinking wine here
但是我们也不是只有这天喝葡萄酒 Presumably they drink wine everyday
也可能每天都会喝酒 Right here it's ritualized, as I said again
所以被仪式化了 重复下 We gotta have four glasses of wine
要喝四杯酒 and we gotta each, drink each glass
每一杯酒都在 at a specified moment in the proceedings
仪式中的一个特定时刻喝 So where does that idea come from?
那么这些想法从何而来呢 What's the history of that?
历史成因如何 We don't know, it's hidden from us
我们不知道 这是个谜 Earlier text before Mishnah mentioned
在密西拿之前的文献提到 drinking wine alongside the paschal sacrifice
喝酒是和逾越节祭品一起进行的 But these texts are all again
但是这些文献 from the late second temple period
都来自之后的第二神庙时期 I talked about second temple
我说的是第二神庙吗 I'll take that back
收回这句 Last centuries BCE, earliest time here
公元前最后一个世纪 是更早的时间 But by time you get the Mishnah
当有了密西拿的时候 It's ritualized
这已经被仪式化了 You drink wine at a specific moments
每一杯酒都在特定的时刻喝 and you drink four cups
一共喝四杯 We don't know where this comes from
我们不知道这从何而来 But, that's part of the Passover Seder
但是这是逾越节家宴的一部分 four cups of wine
四杯酒 Next bullet point
下一个要点 Appetizers
开胃菜 We next eat some appetizers
接下来我们吃开胃菜 going back to the Mishnah
回到密西拿 Right here
就在这里 The Mishnah assumes you have attendance
密西拿假设你有侍者 At the old day
在古代 a mysterious anonymous third person pro
会有一个神秘的匿名的专业侍者 doing things for you
给你做事情 Mishnah does not explain
密西拿没有解释 where does this mysterious attendance come from
这个神秘的侍者从哪里来 How much you have to pay them
你应该给他们付多少钱 Who they are and what if
他们是谁以及 you don't have attendance who does this work
如果你没有侍者的话谁干这些活 Answer, usually the wife who does it
答案是一般是妻子在做这些 But okay, that's just a sociological sign
不过没关系 这是个社会学的符号 So here we have attendance
所以我们有了侍者 Or mysterious servants who are doing things
或者神秘的仆人做这些事情 So if you fill the first cup of wine for him
如果你给他斟满了第一杯酒 him is the householder who is running the show
这里的他是指家宴的主人 then the House of Shammai will fill the day
接下来都是沙麦学派的仪式 the proceeding with blessings
开始进行祝福 The key point here is
这里的关键点是 That the Seder begins as
逾越节家宴 any fancy meal does in Judaism
和任何在犹大地区的豪华晚宴 It begins with a ritualized blessing
都是以仪式化的 over a cup of wine
举杯祝福开始的 Recite the blessing over a cup of wine
以举起酒杯背诵祝词 at the beginning
而开始的 before the food
是在食物之前 Keep this in mind next week please
在下周之前不要忘了这点 when we talk about the Eucharist and
当我们讲到圣餐 the consecration of the bread and the wine
以及面包和酒的献祭 Right, what comes first?
先是什么 Answer, in this text
答案是 在这段文字里面 as in all rabbinic text
在所有的拉比文字里面 We bless the wine first
我们先祝福酒 and we eat the food afterwards
然后再吃食物 Even if the House of Shammai still disagree on
即便是沙麦学派现在仍没有达成一致 the details of the liturgical details
礼拜仪式的细节 Which I will not, it's not concern
我不关心这个 Then, the paragraph three
接下来第三段 They set the food before him
他们把食物在他面前摆好 Here the else, appetizers that I mentioned
除了之前提到的开胃菜 We have lettuce
还有莴苣 We have parperet of the bread
我们有面包的parperet Mysterious word
奇怪的词 no one is quite sure what it means
没人知道是什么意思 Condiment? Course? Question mark
调味品 一道菜 不知道 Not quite sure
不太确定 So we have some kind of lettuce
我们有了一些莴苣 we have something
有一些 some accompaniment of the bread
和面包相关的东西 In this context, class
在这个语境里面 同学们 What would bread mean?
面包是什么意思 Matzah, presumably
大概是无酵饼 Not wonder bread or
不是神奇面包 some other leavened bread
或者别的发酵的面包 This is the evening of the 14th
这是在尼散月的第14天 into the 15th day of Nisan
到第15天的晚上 the beginning of the 7-day matzah festival
七天的无酵节的开始 when you would not see
在家里面不能有 any leaven in your house
任何发酵的东西 Unquote, from Exodus 12
引用完毕 来自出埃及记第12章 So presumably it says the word bread
所以可以推断这里说的面包 But probably, sorry probably
可能 抱歉 不是可能 SURELY it means matzah
肯定说的是无酵饼 Alright, so some kind
是某种 Because matzah is a kind of bread
无酵饼是一种面包 Remember that, next week
记住这个 下周 when we talk about the last supper
当我们讲到最后的晚餐 and Jesus breaks bread
耶稣掰开面包 that bread is matzah
这里的面包就是无酵饼 Okay, back to where we are
好了 言归正传 So, we have the parperet of the bread
我们有面包的parperet Some bread condiment
一种面包的调料 Presumably it's something you smear
可能是一种可以 on top of the bread
涂到面包上面的东西 that going with the matzah
和无酵饼一起吃 I'm not quite sure exactly what this means
我不确定这到底是什么 Then we have here next paragraph
然后是下一段 They set before him unleavened bread
他们在他面前摆好无酵饼 Here it says specifically matzah
这里特别说明是无酵饼 Lettuce, and haroset
莴苣和haroset You saw the picture of the haroset
你们在家宴板的照片上 on the Seder plate earlier
看到过haroset了 That's just a Roman dipping sauce
是一种罗马蘸料 and two cooked foods
还有两种熟食 manuscripts omit two cooked foods
手稿里面忽略了两种熟食 Okay, though the haroset is not compulsory
但是haroset不是必须的 Rabbi Elezar says, it is compulsory
拉比Elezar说 这是必须的 Okay, a little confused here?
有点迷惑吧 Yeah, that's a little confused
是的 有点迷惑 you know exactly what's going on
你们确切地知道在发生什么 We won't pursue the details
我们不会纠结于细节 The key point here is
关键点是 we have, see, we have an appetizer course
我们有一道开胃菜 Okay, and this again here
这个就是 It's here the appetizer course
这就是开胃菜 Matzah, lettuce, haroset
无酵饼 莴苣 haroset What's haroset?
haroset是什么 It's some kind of compound of
我们说过的 various ingredients that are said to
是一种不同材料的混合物 Roman salad dressing
罗马色拉酱调料 or Roman dipping sauce
或者说罗马蘸酱 You want my family recipe?
想要我们家的秘方吗 Talk to me afterwards, right
下课以后和我说 Not a good recipe, but okay
不是特别好 不过还可以 Don't have time to deal with the details
没时间来讲细节 There are different kinds of haroset out there
有各种各样的haroset Each family has their own recipe
每个家庭都有自己的食谱 So appetizer, again
开胃菜 This is ritualized, though
不过这是仪式化的 This is not just a meal when
这不是简单地 we sink with wine and appetizers, Gee
喝酒吃开胃菜的一顿饭 不是 Honey, what do you serve before the meat?
亲爱的 你想在正餐之前上什么菜 Let's have appetizers
我们来吃开胃菜 Sure, there, right
好吧 没问题 No, I'm not talking about that
我说的不是这个 This is ritualized, it's scripted
这是仪式化的 脚本化的 You gotta have it
必须要有这些 This is part of the evening
这是晚宴的一部分 Why do we have this?
我们要有开胃菜 Well, as Bahr argues, let's jump ahead a bit
Bahr争论说 咱们超前一点点 You know, we have here a ritualized
我们会有仪式化的 scripted Roman meal
脚本化的罗马式晚宴 cos on this night
因为在这个晚上 we Jews, we Israelites
我们犹太人 以色列人 we are Roman aristocrat
我们是罗马贵族 We are in 2nd century CE, right
我们在公元二世纪 对吧 That's what you want to be
这就是你想做的人 you want to be honchos, machers
你想做管事儿的人 大人物 people who matter
重要的人 So we pretend we are Roman aristocrat
所以我们假装自己是罗马贵族 having a roman meal
在吃罗马式的晚宴 We are following the script of a Roman meal
我们遵循的是罗马式晚宴的脚本 We were transferring it, translating it
我们把这些转移成 转变成 into a Jewish context
犹太人的方式 Okay, that was these mysterious appetizers
好了 这就是神秘的开胃菜 Okay
好了 After the appetizers, what comes?
开胃菜之后是什么呢 I'm gonna skip this line
我会跳过这段 In the temple they would bring
在神庙里面他们会 the body of the Passover sacrifice before him
把逾越节祭品拿到他的身前 Bahr discuss this correctly
Bahr说的是对的 that this seems to be out of place
看起来这有点不合适 and the sequence here
而这里的顺序 it's a little screwed up
也都有点不对 Not quite sure what to do with this
不太确定应该怎样看这个问题 Interestingly enough the Mishnah
有趣的是密西拿 seems all of a sudden to wax antiquarian
似乎突然封存了史料 That is to say
也就是说 the Mishnah all of a sudden tells you
密西拿突然告诉你说 this what we used to do?
这是我们曾经的做法 But one problem buzz me a lot
但是在密西拿逾越节第10章 in the Mishnah Pesahim 10
有个问题一直困扰着我 It's not clear to me
我一直不太清楚 when you are supposed to eat the meal
你应该什么时候吃晚餐 I know we are eating a meal
我知道我们要吃晚餐 because we have a grace after meal at the end
因为在最后有晚餐后的谢恩祷告 Here
这一段 He then recites the grace after meals
在饭后他背诵了谢恩祷告 Paragraph 7
在第7段 From which I deduce, they're eating a meal
从这里可以推断他们吃了晚餐 But when exactly are they eating meal?
但是具体是什么时间吃晚餐呢 The Mishnah weren't tells me
密西拿没有告诉我们 In this line here
这一句 In the temple they'll bring the
在神庙里面他们 body of sacrifice before them
把祭品拿到他前面 It seems to be out of place
似乎有点不合适 Okay, look at Bahr who discusses this
看一下Bahr对此的讨论 It remind me, again, class
这再次提醒了我 同学们 In the temple, they would bring
在神庙里面 他们会 They used to bring the good old days
他们曾经会 在从前的黄金年代 we brought these Passover sacrifice
会拿出逾越节祭品 At the time of the Mishnah
在密西拿时代 are they still bringing the Passover sacrifice?
他们还会拿出逾越节祭品吗 No
不会 No, cos the temple had been destroyed when?
不会 因为神庙在什么时候被毁掉了 70
公元七十年
70, so this is an antiquarian reference
公元七十年 所以这是在引用史料 70, so this is an antiquarian reference
在黄金年代 到了这个时候 In the old days, at this point
他们会拿出逾越节祭品 they would brought the paschal sacrifice
好了 我们讲到哪里了 Okay, so what do we got so far?
我们喝了酒 我们吃了开胃菜 We have wine, we have the appetizers
各种熟食还有色拉酱调料 Various cooked foods and salad dressings
调味品等等 condiments and what not?
然后 Right, and then
我们斟上第二杯酒 We fill the second cup
因为第一杯已经喝完了 Cos you drank the first cups
所以重新倒满 So you refill it
现在准备好了 So it's ready to go
接下来是脚本化的对话 And now comes the scripted speech
仪式化的言语行为 Right, the ritualized speech acts
我倾向于这样说 I attempted to call it
不是在饭桌旁一些没有目地的闲谈 Right, not some aimless chatter around the table
而是一系列的主题 But rather, we have a set of themes
以及我们要引用的 and a set of texts
一套对话 that we'll now recite
提前下一个结论 And to jump ahead a piece
就是这个最终使得 This is what ultimately
逾越节家宴成为逾越节家宴 makes the Seder a Seder
不止是食物 It's not just the food
而是伴随食物的言语行为 It's the speech acts that accompanied the food
这时 另外一种翻译可能是 Okay, here, or another translation might be
这样更合适 在hum这里断开 Rightly, instead of punctuating at the hum
而不是haw这里 instead of the haw
儿子问他的父亲 The son questions his father
或者现代的性别中立的翻译 Or in modern gender neutral translations
子女问他们的父母 The child asks his parents
但是我肯定密西拿是在说 But I'm pretty sure the Mishnah means
儿子问他的父亲 the son asks his father, right
很肯定 Pretty sure
在公元200年还没有 There were not politically correct yet
政治正确问题 in the year 200 CE
儿子问他的父亲 The son questions his father
如果儿子很无知 If the son is unintelligent
他的父亲会教他怎么问问题 his father instruct him how to ask
父亲会让他问 The father instructs him to ask
今天晚上和别的晚上有什么不同呢 How is this night different from all other nights?
因为其他晚上我们吃发酵的 For all other nights we eat leavened
和没发酵的面包 and unleavened bread
但是在今天晚上 whereas on this night
我们只吃没发酵的面包 we eat only unleavened bread
我用一种传统语调来读这段 I'm using one traditional tune for this
这就是著名的四个问题 These are the famous four questions
这是四个要点 Here are the four bullet points
一 二 三 四 One, two, three, four
如果你读得很仔细 If you look at the thing very carefully
当然你会发现 Of course you'll notice that
很多手稿里面少了这一个 many manuscripts leaves this one out
所以就只有三个问题 So therefore we only have three questions
三个而不是四个 Three points not four
你还会注意到 You'll notice too that
如果你很熟悉逾越节 if you are familiar with the Passover
马尼什坦拿仪式问题 Ma Nishtana liturgy questions
你们小时候读过的 you read them as a kid
你会注意到我们提到的 You'll notice that the ones we have
和你们看过的不一样 are not the same as these
其中一个不一样 One of them is different
所以如果综合起来 So you put them altogether
一共是五个问题 You wind up was five
所以不太清楚 So, and it's not clear at all
到底是四个问题 If these are four questions or
还是一个问题加上四个答案 one question with four answers
所以有各种乱七八糟的说法 so, there's all kinds of these messy things
但这不是我们关注的问题 But this is not our problem
这些都是很有趣的问题 All these are interesting problems
但是不会对我们课上 But they are not the problem
讨论的内容有任何影响 that can really affects us in our class
我们只有一个要点 You simply have a point
就是父亲要指导他的儿子 that father is supposed to instruct the son
如果儿子不知道怎么问 And if the son doesn't know enough to ask
如果儿子完全不知道在发生什么 as the son is clueless what's going on
父亲要采取主动 then the father is to take initiative
告诉他发生了什么 and instruct him what's going on
所以这里有四个问题 Right, so here's other four questions
或者四个主题要讨论 or four topics for discussion
无酵饼 Right, unleavened bread
苦草 吃烤的 炖的或者煮的食物 bitter herbs, eating roast, stewed or boiled
在这个晚上只吃烤的 on this night only roast
来自出埃及记第12章的说法 following Exodus 12
说的是要烤羊羔 which says if you roast the lamb
在申命记第16章用的是另外一个动词 not Deuteronomy 16 which has a different verb
这很让人疑惑 that's confusing
但是在出埃及记第12章是烤羊羔 But in the Exodus 12 we roast the lamb
平时的晚上我们蘸一次蘸料 Other nights we dip once
在这个晚上我们蘸两次 on this night we dip twice
因为今天晚上我们是罗马贵族 Cos on this night, we are Roman aristocrat
所以我们要多蘸几次蘸料 And we have multiple courses of dipping
所以我们有仪式化的问题 So we have then ritualized question
仪式化的指导 ritualized instruction
然后是这句 and then this line
根据儿子的智力水平 according to the son's intelligence
他的父亲要指导他 his father instructs him
有问题吗 Questions, anyone?
你们明白我说的吧 You understand what I'm saying
这是仪式化的对话 This is ritualized speech
不是自由发挥的 Right, it's not freeform
是有脚本的 We have a script
然后是很奇怪的一句 Then comes a mysterious line
他 大概就是父亲 He, presumably the father
指导他的儿子 who's instructing the son
他由羞愧开始 He commences with shame
以赞美结束 and concludes with praise
(希伯来语) Commences with shame
由羞愧开始 and concludes with praise
以赞美结束 Is that clear what that means?
知道这是什么意思吗 Yeah, I agree with you
是的 我和你们一样 It's also, it's not at all clear what that means
完全不清楚说的是什么意思 It's rather cryptic
含义非常模糊 I think the simplest way to understand that
我认为最简单的理解方式是 is to assume that this line
假设这句 leads into the next line
引出了后面的一句 Right, as the header for the next line
这是下一句的引子 Though I punctuated it as a separate line
我把这句分成了两句 Which tells how would understands it
也就是我的理解方式 But I think the simplest way to take
但是我认为最简单的解释 would be to say this line introduces
是把这句当成 or is the first half of the sentence
这句的前半句 which continues in the second half
接下来是后半句 and expounds from
然后从这句开始 A wandering Aramean was my father
我祖原是一个将亡的亚兰人 until he completes the whole section
一直到他说完整段话 Alright, what is that?
好了 这是什么 Well, luckily, Prof Cohen put on his lecture notes
幸运的是 Cohen教授把整段笔记 the whole passage
都放到讲义上了 So it's right here
就是这里 So what is this passage
这段是什么意思 A wandering Aramean was my father
我祖原是一个将亡的亚兰人 So here is this passage from Deuteronomy 26
这段来自申命记第26章 And a lot of interesting things going on here too
也有很多有趣的事情 Excuse me a moment, fine
我先看下时间 还好 When you enter the land
你到了 The Lord has given you as a heritage
耶和华你神 and you possess it, settle in it
所赐你为业之地居住 you shall take some of every fruit of the soil
就要从耶和华你神赐你的地上 which you harvest from the land you bring
将所收的各种初熟的土产取些来 etc., etc
等等 And you shall go to the place
往耶和华你神 where the Lord, your God
所选择 will choose to establish his name
要立为他名的居所去 That is a paraphrastic construction
这一段很容易理解 which means, you shall go to the Temple
意味着你应该去神庙 you shall go to the temple in Jerusalem
你应该去耶路撒冷的神庙 But the word Jerusalem never appears
但是耶路撒冷这个词从来没有 in the Book of Deuteronomy
在申命记里面出现过 Instead you have this mysterious
只有这段神秘的累赘的陈述 circumlocution many times
出现了好多次 The place that God will choose
耶和华你神所选择 to establish his name
要立为他名的居所 You shall go to the priest in charge
见当时作祭司的 and say to him
对他说 Blablabla
等等等 I acknowledge this day
我今日向耶和华你神明认 the priest shall take your basket from your hand
祭司就从你手里取过筐子来 set it down in front of the altar of Lord
放在耶和华你神的坛前 You shall then recite as follows before the Lord
你要在耶和华你神面前说 Everybody got the scene?
大家看明白了吗 You brought a basket of
你拿了一筐 first fruits into the Temple
初熟的水果到神庙 You gave it, you the farmer
你是农夫 Israelite farmer
以色列农夫 You gave it to the priest
你把这些给祭司 Priest accepts it, acknowledges it
祭司接过来 认可了 And then you'll recite this
然后你要说下面的话 What do you say?
你要说什么 You, Israelite farmer, what do you say?
你 以色列的农夫 应该说什么 My father was fugitive Aramean
我祖原是一个将亡的亚兰人 Different translation
不同的译法 My father was a wandering Aramean
我祖原是一个将亡的亚兰人 Here is that passage
这就是密西拿逾越节 to which Mishnah Pesahim is referring
所提到的段落 He went down to Egypt with
下到埃及寄居 meager numbers and sojourns there
他人口稀少 Then he became a great
在那里却成了 and very populous nation
又大又强 人数很多的国民 The Egyptians dealt harshly with us
埃及人恶待我们 and oppressed us
苦害我们 they imposed heavy labor upon us
将劳工加在我们身上 We cried to the Lord
于是我们哀求耶和华 the God of our Fathers
我们列祖的神 the Lord heard our plea
耶和华听见我们的声音 and saw our plight, our misery
看见我们所受的困苦 劳碌 and our oppression
欺压 Lord freed us from Egypt by a might hand
他就用大能的手和 and an outstretched arm
伸出来的膀臂 and awesome power
并大可畏的 by signs and portents, or signs of wonders
事与神迹奇事 He brought us to this place
领我们出了埃及 and gave us this land
将我们领进这地方 a land flowing with milk and honey
把这流奶与蜜之地赐给我们 Therefore, I'll bring the first fruits
耶和华啊 现在我把 of the soil which you, O Lord
你所赐给我地上 which you have given to me
初熟的土产奉了来 That's the passage
就是这段 And I would argue this passage
我会说这一段 fulfills the mandate
完全符合要求 Would begin with shame
以羞愧开始 and ends with glory
以赞美结束 To begin with shame
以羞愧开始 My father was a fugitive Aramean
我祖原是一个将亡的亚兰人 a wandering Aramean
将亡的亚兰人 and ends up with glory
以赞美结束 Now God you gave me the land
上帝赐给了我们土地 and here I'll bring you the first fruits
所以我们献上最初熟的果实 Now the interesting point, class
而有趣的是 同学们 Is this passage having
这一段和逾越节 anything to do with Passover?
有任何关系吗 No, it's the Firstfruits festival
没有 这是初熟节 Is Passover Firstfruits festival?
逾越节是初熟节吗 It's too early a season
太早了 It's all in the spring
逾越节是在春天 We don't have first fruits yet
还没有初熟的水果呢 So the Firstfruits festival
所以初熟节 is whatever it is
就是初熟节 But the sages, our rabbinic sages
但是圣人 我们的拉比圣人 who gave us the Seder
创立了逾越节家宴的圣人 took this line from the Firstfruit declaration
把这段从初熟节中拿出来 and transferred it to
转化成了 the center piece of instruction
逾越节晚上指令的 on the evening of Passover
中心段落 It's part of the Seder
成为逾越节家宴的一部分 Why did they pick this paragraph to do so?
为什么他们会选这段 Answer, I don't know, and nobody knows
答案是 我不知道 也没有人知道 But the obvious suggestion would be
但是很明显的一点是 It's a very lovely one-paragraph
这一大段非常好地 short capsule summary of
囊括了以色列的人的 Israelite sacred history
神圣历史 Focusing on Israelites going to Egypt
讲到了以色列人到了埃及 getting enslaved, getting redeemed
为奴 被释放 and then returning
然后回到埃及 That's the story
就是这个故事 Here you have the whole story in 3 sentences
三段话就讲完了整个故事 So it works educationally speaking
所以从教育意义的角度说 Pedagogically speaking
从教学法的角度说 it's a nice capsule summary of the
这一段非常好地囊括了 sacred history of the Israelites
以色列人的神圣历史 and the story of the Passover
和逾越节的故事 That's the best I can do
这是我能做出的最好的解释 You like the explanation?
喜欢这种解释 Great
很好 Don't like the explanation?
不喜欢这种解释 or not entirely happy with it
或者不是特别满意 Then I get nothing better to offer
我也没有更好的答案了 Then it's your turn
你们自己研究 Okay, so here we have
好了 现在我们讲了 If you look at the current Haggadahs
如果你看看现在的哈加达 This is the part that most people skip
这一段是大多数人会跳过的 So the Haggadah gives this paragraph
哈加达给了我们这个段落 and then takes apart each of these phrases
然后把这些短语 individual phrases and discusses
这些独立的短语和讨论 each of these phrases in a way
把这些短语以一种 that most people find completely baffling
大多数人觉得莫名其妙的 and bewildering, right?
疑惑的方式分解开来 So the, our current Haggadah
所以现在的哈加达 takes this paragraph and then expands upon it
选择了这段然后扩展开来 This is what I meant when it said
这就是我说过的 we have scriptural exegesis
我们需要释经 We quote Scripture, and then explains it
我们引用圣经 然后解读它 Mishnah just tells you
密西拿告诉我们 this is what you are supposed to do
这就是正确的做法 Then verse 5, line, paragraph 5
然后是第5节 第5段 back in Mishnah
回到密西拿 Questions?
有问题吗 Okay, so I'll keep going
那我就继续了 Paragraph 5, Rabbi Gamaliel used to say
第5段 迦玛列拉比曾经说过 Whoever does not mention these
如果没有在逾越节 three things on Passover
提到这三样东西 does not fulfill his obligation
就没有完成他的使命 And these are they
这些包括 the Passover sacrifice
逾越节祭品 unleavened bread and bitter herb
无酵饼和苦草 Once again, ritualized speech, right
再说一次 仪式化的对话 对吧 You can talk about
你可以说 whatever you want to talk about
任何你想说的东西 You gotta make sure you mentioned
但是务必要提到 these three things, Rabbi Gamaliel says
三样东西 迦玛列拉比如是说 Otherwise you won't fulfill your obligation
否则你就没有完成你的使命 What obligation is that?
是什么使命呢 The obligation of teaching?
教育的使命 Apparently, that's the simplest way to take it
很明显 这是最简单的解释 Apparently Rabbi Gamaliel means
很明显迦玛列拉比是在说 your obligation to teach your child
你有教育孩子的使命 to teach your son, right?
教育儿子的使命 对吧 You gotta make sure
你一定要 when you are instructing your son
在指导你儿子的时候 that you hit these three topics
提到这三个话题 I'm not 100% sure that's what it means
我不是完全肯定就是这个意思 But that's the simplest way to take it
但是这是最简单的解释 That's how it's usually understood
也是大多数人的理解方式 So what are the big three themes?
这三个大的主题都有什么 Passover sacrifice, the Hebrew word is Pesah?
逾越节祭品 希伯来词是Pesah Unleavened bread, matzah
无酵饼 matzah And bitter herbs, maror
苦草 maror So here we have Passover sacrifice
这里说到了逾越节祭品 Once upon a time that was real food
曾经是真正的食物 That's what you ate
在逾越节 in the Passover eve
晚上吃的 Nowadays, by the time Rabbi Gamaliel
现在 在拉比迦玛列的时代 assuming this is the famous Rabbi Gamaliel
这应该是公元二世纪著名的 of the second century
迦玛列拉比 Not Rabbi Gamaliel in the first century, right
不是公元一世纪的迦玛列拉比 For him already, this is reminiscence
从那时候开始 就已经是回忆了 Or what we used to eat in the old days
我们曾经在以前吃的东西 when we had a temple
那个时候还有神庙 unleavened bread matzah
无酵饼 which of course we still eat on this eve
当然我们还会在逾越节晚上吃 And bitter herbs of course
还有苦草 we eat that still
我们也还在吃 Then we have brief lines
然后有几句简单地 explaining what these three are
解释了一下这三样东西 And then, that's the three
然后 这就是三样东西 then we have this important line
然后是重要的一句 We'll talk about too in a moment
我们一会再讲 In every generation
每一代人 Not clear whether this is a continuation of
不太确定这是不是在延续 Gamaliel's statement
迦玛列说的话 apparently it's an independent statement
很明显这是独立的一句 The Mishnah talking
密西拿的话 kind of give us a liturgical conclusion
给了我们一个关于礼拜仪式的总结 In every generation
每一代人 one is bound to regard himself
一定要认为自己 as if he personally had gone forth from Egypt
就是那个从埃及逃出来的人 Namely, you, the Jewish person
也就是说 你 犹太人 who's doing this ritual
进行这些仪式的人 You are thereby transformed
你的身份改变了 You are not a poor Jewish farmer
你不再是公元二世纪 of the 2nd century CE
可怜的犹太农夫 You in fact are now
事实上你现在 not even a Roman aristocrat
也不是罗马贵族了 Pretending Roman aristocrat
假装是公元二世纪的 of the 2nd century CE
罗马贵族 You have become that Israelite
你成了那个几代人之前 liberated from slavery generations ago
解除了奴隶身份的以色列人 Their experience is now yours
这个经历现在是你的了 You are to regard yourself as if
你要认为你自己 you personally had gone forth out of Egypt
就是那个从埃及逃出来的人 So it's transformative
意思改变了 Or it's meant to be transformative
或者说就是要改变 Then we have a praise of phrase, sorry
然后是话的赞美 抱歉 Phrase of praise, hoo, that's tough
赞美的话 呼 真难读 Then we have paragraph of
然后是一段 praise of God over here
对上帝的赞美 full of God's wondrous deeds
赞美上帝的伟大行为 recites him Psalms, etc., etc
引用诗篇 等等 And then we argue about how to get to
然后讨论怎么样 conclude these Psalms, liturgically speaking
结束引用诗篇 和礼拜仪式 Right, then we skip to third cup of wine
然后是第三杯酒 Then we have grace after meals
然后是饭后谢恩祷告 Mishnah, you forgot something
密西拿 你忘了一件事儿 When do we eat?
我们什么时候吃东西 Which is the main question
这是逾越节晚上 most children ask on Passover eve, right?
大多数孩子会问的主要问题 对吧 When do we eat?
我们什么时候吃东西 Mishnah, you skip to the grace after meals
密西拿 直接说到了饭后谢恩祷告 but where's the meal part?
但是吃饭的部分呢 As I mentioned earlier
我之前提到过 I'm not quite sure where the meal is
我不确定在这种情况下 in this context
什么时间吃饭 I know traditionally nowadays
我知道今天的传统 The post-mishnaic custom is
后密西拿时代的传统 We eat meal between
是在第6段和第7段 paragraph 6 and paragraph 7
中间的时候吃饭 We finish these liturgical formula
完成了那些礼拜仪式 recites some Psalms
引用了一些诗篇 And then right here, this gap
然后就是这个时候 中间的空隙 We eat the meal
我们吃东西 paragraph 7, grace after meals
第7段 饭后谢恩祷告 Okay, I just wish the Mishnah had said that
我希望密西拿能够明示 That we'd be a lot more reassuring
我们就能放心多了 But okay
但是没关系 What can I do?
我能做什么呢 I wasn't there
我没在那个年代 So they didn't ask my opinion
没有人问我的意见 So here we have the third cup
我们喝掉第三杯酒 Grace after meals
饭后的谢恩祷告 That's a real meal, not a symbolic meal
这是真正的食物 不是象征性的食物 real meal, real food with, you know
真正的饭 真正的食物 real dessert and everything else
真正的饭后甜点之类的 Sorry, leave out dessert
抱歉 没有甜点 Didn't say that
我收回 You have a real meal
吃过了真正的饭 Then you have the fourth cup
然后是第四杯酒 It concludes the Hallel
包括节日赞美诗 or Psalms and Hymns and Song
诗篇 赞美诗和赞歌 Then we have a couple of brief notes
然后是几个简单的注释 including this note, paragraph 8
注释里面说 第8段 which I will come back to
我后面会讲 We do not bid farewell
不要以afiqoman to the paschal meal with afiqoman
来结束逾越节晚宴 Word of uncertain origin and uncertain meaning
无法确定来源和含义的一个词 which I will come back to
我后面会讲 And here are some more brief liturgical notes
然后是一些仪式摘要 or ritual notes
仪式的注释 So here we are, so we have a meal
到了这里 我们已经吃过了饭 back to my bullet points
回到我的要点 not clear exactly where it is supposed to be
不太确定什么时间吃的 But presumably you are eating the meal
但是假设你吃了饭 and hymns and praise, and so on
念了赞美诗和赞词 and then it's done
然后就结束了 Yes
请说 Why are you so certain that meal
为什么你那么肯定那顿饭 has to be a real meal and doesn't just refer
是真正的食物而不是指 to some symbolic foods, that please?
一些象征的食物 Good question
很好的问题 Certainly when there was a real paschal lamb
肯定地说有真正的逾越节羊羔的时候 It would have been a real meal
是会有真正的食物的 which is to say, roast lamb
就是说 烤羊羔 I'm assuming that even in the absence
可以假设就算没有 of a real paschal lamb
真正的逾越节羊羔 you would eat a real meal
还是会吃真的食物 Why am I 100% sure of that?
为什么我会百分之百肯定 I'm 100% sure of that
我会百分之百肯定 because that is what we do
是因为这就是我们的做法 with this question
对于这个问题 Maybe the Mishnah doesn't think
可能是密西拿认为你 you have a real meal
没有真正的食物 Is it possible that the Mishnah
可能是密西拿 assumes you don't have a paschal lamb
假设你没有逾越节羔羊 there's no real meal any more
再也没有真正的食物了 But then why you say grace after meals?
但是为什么说饭后谢恩祷告 See, that's the killer then
这是最大的问题 You have grace after meals
如果有饭后谢恩祷告 Grace after meal is only after a meal
饭后谢恩祷告要在饭后才行 You don't say grace after meals after a snack
不会说点心谢恩祷告 Just eating some celery and parsley
只吃一些西芹和欧芹 That's not a grace after meals
这不是饭后谢恩祷告 So therefore it's gonna be a meal, alright?
所以必须要有一顿饭 对吧 This Mishnah could have been a little clearer
密西拿可以更清楚一点说明 exactly on how that's done
到底这些应该做 Other questions?
其他问题 Okay, now let's get to the big points
好了 咱们讲最重要的一点 What time is it, better hurry up
几点了 最好讲快点儿 Mishnah's two key theological ideas
密西拿的两个主要的神学观点 Vicarious experience
替代性经验 I've already mentioned that
我已经提过了 What is vicarious mean?
替代性是什么意思 Somebody else, right
其他人 对吧 From Latin, vicar, right
来自拉丁语 vicar Vicarious experience, right?
替代性经验 That we are to imagine ourselves
就是我们想象自己 as if we ourselves
好像就是我们自己 have gone through the Exodus from Egypt
经历了出埃及 So it's transformative
这是一种转换 Remember these things
别忘了这个 when we talk about the Eucharist next week
我们会在下周讲到圣餐 Okay, we have saved a moment of a hint
刚刚说的这个会是个暗示 Redemption from Egypt
从埃及被救赎 prefigures our future redemption
预示着我们未来的救赎 While we are talking about the whole evening
我们讲的整个逾越节晚上 about the redemption of
都是关于我们的祖先 our ancestors from Egypt
从埃及被救赎 slaves, Israelites slaves in Egypt
奴隶 在埃及的以色列奴隶 Surely, clearly, what we are really talking about
肯定地 清楚地 我们是在说 or the subtext, or the intertext
或者说潜台词 或者说真正的意思 is we are talking about us
是在说我们自己 That we not only imagine ourselves
不只是想象我们自己 being redeemed from Egypt then
在古时候从埃及被救赎 We imagine ourselves
还要想象我们自己 of course, being redeemed now
现在就在被救赎 That's very clear in these prayers here
很明显这些祈祷者 These prayers in Akiba
这些在阿吉巴的祈祷者 With a clear and unambiguous reference to
很清楚明白地提到了 the messianic redemption at the end of days
当神庙被重建 救世主在 when the temple will be rebuilt
末日的救赎 And Messiah will restore things
弥赛亚会让一切复原 I'm not quite sure what Messiah is
我不确定弥赛亚是什么 Don't worry, we'll come to that in a few weeks
不用担心 我们过几周会讲 It's all bleak
这些都很无望 But nonetheless, unmistakable
不过尽管如此 肯定不会错 So Passover represents
所以逾越节不光代表着 not just redemption, past
过去的救赎 but also, redemption, future
也代表着未来的救赎 Namely, just as God redeemed our ancestors
也就是说 就像上帝救赎我们的祖先一样 So too God will redeem us
上帝也会救赎我们 That's an implicit theme throughout
这是贯穿始终的潜台词 Here Prof. Cohen has an interesting note
这里Cohen教授有个有趣的注释 Passover's paradigm of redemption
逾越节救赎的范例 analogous to Christian typology
类似于基督教的象征论 Remember typology?
还记得象征论吗 You say you do, okay, good
你们说自己知道 好的 很好 Christian typology, right, so the same thing
基督教的象征论 一样的东西 The Israelites were redeemed from Egypt
以色列人从埃及被救赎 that represents a pattern of history
代表着是一种历史模式 That pattern of history will be
这种历史模式 can be reenacted
会被重演 Just as in Christian thinking
就像基督徒认为 Christ, life of Christ reenacts
基督 基督的复活 various moments from the Hebrew Bible's
各种各样希伯来圣经里面的时刻 in scriptural stories of the Hebrew Bible
希伯来圣经里面的故事 Similarly here, we
类似地 我们 We Jews by being redeemed
我们犹太人被救赎 will also reenact the pattern, story
也是重演了出埃及的 of the Exodus from Egypt
模式 故事 Okay, questions?
好了 有问题吗 David, you wanna say?
David 你有问题吗 If past redemption is from slavery
如果过去的救赎是解除奴隶身份 What's future redemption from?
那未来的救赎会是什么 It's from whatever existential condition
可以是任何现在存在的 that we current have and we don't like
但是我们不喜欢的情况 Maybe it's living under the Romans
可能是生活在罗马人的统治下 Maybe it's the sense that
可能是因为 God's presence in the world
上帝在世界中出现的姿态 is not as apparent as it should be
不是想象中的那样 Maybe it's the sense of
可能是因为 our own spiritual adequacy
我们自己的精神上欠缺 It could be whatever
有各种可能 Whatever you think is the Egypt
任何和埃及类似的情况 That goes back to that
回到密西拿里面 mysterious phrase in the Mishnah
神秘的说法 It commences with shame
由羞愧开始 and concludes with praise
以赞美结束 What's the shame?
什么是羞愧 They may where we're going
可能是从我们 from the status of we are unhappy
不幸的状态 to a status of praise
到赞美的状态 And the God redeeming us from shame
上帝把我们从羞愧中救赎出来 and taking us to a situation
把我们带到一个新的境地 where we praise the Lord
我们开始赞美上帝 That could be spiritual
可能是精神上的 That could be physical
可能是肉体上的 That could be whatever
各种可能性 That's what we are doing in this evening
这就是我们在逾越节晚上做的 Shame, slavery in Egypt, to redemption
羞愧 在埃及为奴 被救赎 Okay, those of you briefly
简单地说就是这些 We'll do a Passover Seder
我们举办逾越节家宴 We'll have noticed that
我们会注意到 I'll go through this quickly
我快速地讲一下 That some of your favorite parts of the Seder
一些关于逾越节家宴你最喜欢的部分 aren't in there, in the Mishnah
在密西拿里面没有 How is this possible?
这怎么可能 What's wrong, professor?
出什么问题了 教授 Where is the dipping of the salt water?
蘸盐水的仪式呢 Which every school, Hebrew school child knows
每一个希伯来学校的学生都知道 You have the salt water
盐水是用来 to remind you of the tears of Israelites?
让你回忆起以色列人的眼泪 Well, it's not there yet
密西拿里没有 Okay, how about the for-sons passages?
那些教育儿子的段落呢 Nowadays for-children passages?
现在教育孩子的段落 It's also not there yet
密西拿里面也没有 Yeah, you are right, it's not there yet
是的 你是对的 没有 And how about the cup of Elijah?
那么以利亚之杯呢 How about the songs at the end
最后的那首歌呢 Chad Gadya, Echad Mi Yodea
Chad Gadya Echad Mi Yodea How about, you know, Dayenu
还有 Dayenu之歌 Our favorite, day-day-enu, favorite song
我们最喜欢的 day-day-enu 最喜欢的歌 Where is it?
哪去了 Answer, it's not there yet
答案是 暂时还没有 Mishnah is the beginning of
密西拿是逾越节家宴 the development of the Seder ritual
仪式发展的开始 not the end, it's the beginning
不是结束 是开始 There's lot of things that are gonna get added
还有很多东西会被加进来 The traditional Jewish history of liturgy
犹太人礼拜仪式的传统 Nothing is ever taken away
不会拿掉任何东西 things are only added
只会增加 just gets longer, longer, and longer
会越来越长 越来越长 Right, wait another millennia
再等一千年 and things will, you see things pop up
你会看到很多新东西出现 Okay, the interesting one here
这里比较有趣的是 Pay attention to the cup of Elijah
注意以利亚之杯 Elijah is the prophetic forerunner of
以利亚是对于密西拿会到来 the mishnaic delivery, the Messiah
预言的先驱 也就是弥赛亚 So on Passover Eve
所以在逾越节晚上 we hope the Elijah will be coming around to town
我们希望以利亚会出现 Elijah will return
以利亚会回归 Because that means, Elijah is announcing
因为这意味着 以利亚会宣布 the arrival of the messiah
弥赛亚的到来 The arrival of mishnaic redeeming
弥赛亚救赎的到来 And of course
当然 in some speaking Jewishly at the moment
这个时候用犹太人的说法 I don't mean Jesus
我不是在说耶稣 I mean, our Messiah, the real Messiah
我是在说 我们的弥赛亚 真正的弥赛亚 Speaking Jewishly
犹太人的说法 So that's the Elijah that
这就是我们 we look forward to again
所期待的以利亚 Emphasizing the fact
强调了事实上 this whole festival is about redemption
整个节日都是关于救赎的 Past, redemption, future
过去 救赎 未来 Okay, major historical question
好了 最大的历史悬疑 Does the mishnaic Seder predate 70CE or not?
密西拿逾越节家宴是否早于公元70年 When the Israelites, Jews
当以色列人 犹太人 were gathering at the 2nd temple times
在第二神庙时期聚集起来 and they actually had a paschal lamb
有真正的逾越节羊羔的时候 and they actually gathered at the temple
他们在神庙聚集起来 slaughtered it
杀掉羊羔 pour the blood out on the foot of the altar
把血倒在圣坛的底座上 roasted it and then ate it by family units
以家庭为单位烤羊羔吃羊肉 or run the praising of Jerusalem
或者颂耶路撒冷赞词 did they have a Seder
那个时候有逾越节家宴吗 or they just sit down to eat?
还是只是坐下来吃东西 Another way to phrase this question is
这个问题的另外一个问法是 was the last supper of Jesus and his disciples
耶稣和他的门徒的最后的晚餐 a paschal meal?
是逾越节晚宴吗 Was it a Seder or not?
是不是逾越节家宴 So this is discussed at some length by Bahr
Bahr对此有过一些讨论 in the article I asked you
就在那些让你们读的文章里面 which is a little technical I admit
我承认有一定的技术性 but you can pay attention to the big point
但是你可以关注于主要的问题 and don't get smothered in details
不要纠结那些细节 Right? He was asking this question
他问了这个问题 you see, it's a real question
这是个真正的问题 The answer is not clear
答案不是太清楚 However, I have no doubt about this matter
但是我对此没有怀疑 I know it's not clear
我知道答案不是很清楚 Nonetheless, it's clear to me
但是对我来说这很清楚 that there was no Seder pre-70CE
在公元70之前没有逾越节家宴 Here following the view of
接下来是我已经过世的朋友 my late friend Barrow Buxer
Barrow Buxer的观点 who wrote a book on the origins of the Seder
他写了一本关于逾越节家宴起源的书 in which Barrow argues that
Barrow认为 this whole elaboration of Mishnah Pesahim
密西拿逾越节的各种详细描述 this whole scripted meal, scripted text
脚本化的晚宴 脚本化的对话 scripted teaching, scripted instruction
脚本化的教导 脚本化的说明 All of that is to replace that
这些都的为了取代 which no longer is
那些不存在的东西 Here's the paradox
这有个悖论 In the Haggadah, sorry, in the Seder
在哈加达 抱歉 在逾越节家宴 Pride of place is taken by the paschal lamb
逾越节羔羊是居首要地位的 But there is no paschal lamb
但是已经没有了逾越节羔羊 Paschal lamb is gone
逾越节羔羊消失了 The Romans sought to look at it
罗马人倾向于 there is no more paschal lamb
没有逾越节羔羊了 The temple has been destroyed
神庙已经毁灭了 So what do we do, we Jews do?
所以我们犹太人要怎么做 We have a choice
我们有一个选择 We didn't spend the 14th day
我们不会在尼散月的 the 15th day of Nisan
第14天到第15天 at home doing nothing
在家里什么都不做 Or the creative geniuses of rabbinic Judaism
拉比犹太教创造性的天才们说 said, I know what we'll do
我知道我们应该怎么做 We'll do these talking
我们说这些对话 all these scripturalized
这些脚本化的 scriptural, ritualized, scripted talk
圣经中的 仪式化的 脚本化的对话 we'll talk about the paschal lamb
我们谈论逾越节羔羊 we'll commemorate it
我们纪念它 we'll remind ourselves of it
我们提醒自己 we'll talk around it
我们谈论它 and that will take the place of the paschal lamb
这些就成了代替逾越节羔羊的东西 So the whole Seder is actually designed
所以整个逾越节家宴其实是为了 to fill up the void
添补那些空白 caused by the destruction of the Temple
那些因为神庙被摧毁 and the absence of the paschal lamb
逾越节羔羊消失而造成的空白 If this is correct
如果这是正确的 and I'm sure my late friend
我肯定我的朋友 Barrow Boxer got this right
Barrow Boxer是正确的 Then the Seder as we see it
那么我们在密西拿逾越节第10章 in Mishnah Pesahim 10
里面看到的逾越节家宴 while it derives from various elements
源自曾经有过的 that came before
各种元素 is fundamentally a rabbinic creation
基本上是在公元70年后 of the post-70 period
由拉比创造的 Which would mean that Jesus and his disciples
这意味着耶稣和他的门徒 are having a paschal meal
确实是在吃逾越节晚宴 were eating a paschal lamb
是在吃逾越节羔羊 as I'll discuss next week
我们下周会讨论这个 and there are some intermissions there
这里面有一些中断 well, looks like a Passover Seder, sort of
看起来像是逾越节家宴 But it's not really a Passover Seder
但是其实不是逾越节家宴 cos it doesn't have the key elements of
因为没有那些关键元素 question, answer, instruction
问题 答案 教导 scriptural readings, scriptural exegesis
脚本化的诵读 脚本化的释经 Cos that's what makes a Seder a Seder
因为这些使得逾越节家宴成为逾越节家宴 Okay, last
好了 最后 Two minutes run on time
多占用两分钟 Mysterious afiqoman
神秘的afiqoman Right, Mishnah Pesahim has this mysterious line
密西拿逾越节里面有这样一句神秘的话 We did not bid farewell to
不要以afiqoman the paschal meal with afiqoman
来结束逾越节晚宴 What does that mean?
这是什么意思 So in the Mishnah
在密西拿里面 this mysterious word afiqoman
这个神秘的词afiqoman is something that we don't do
是我们不要做的事情 We don't bid farewell to the paschal meal
不要这样结束逾越节晚宴 We don't conclude the meal
不要这样结束晚宴 We don't end the meal with afiqoman
不要以afiqoman结束晚宴 It's almost always translated with
希腊语的翻译方法 one of any different terms in Greek
总是会用另外的说法 referring to after-dinner entertainment
指的是饭后的娱乐 or after-dinner desserts
饭后的甜点 or, you know, bring on the dancing girls
就是那些让跳舞的女孩出来 You know, we don't do that in the paschal meal
我们不会在逾越节晚宴之后做这些 We eat the paschal meal and it's done
我们吃完逾越节晚宴 就结束了 We eat the Passover lamb and it's done
我们吃完逾越节羔羊 就结束了 That probably is what the Mishnah meant
也许这就是密西拿的意思 when it said, we do not end
当它说 不要以afiqoman bid farewell to the paschal meal with afiqoman
来结束逾越节晚宴 with the usual after-dinner condiments
那些常见的饭后的佐料 after-dinner entertainments
饭后的娱乐 Right, so the paschal meal
所以逾越节晚宴就是 is the highlight of the evening, period
整个晚上最重要的事情 就此打住 No distractions
不要其他干扰 Presumably that's what the Mishnah meant
假设这就是密西拿提到的 with reference to the paschal lamb itself
逾越节羔羊的真正含义 However nowadays we use the word afiqoman
但是今天afiqoman这个词 in a very different sense
含义已经完全不同了 What does the word afiqoman mean nowadays?
现在的afiqoman是什么意思 Well, afiqoman is referring to
afiqoman指的是 a piece of matzah that we do eat
我们吃的一块无酵饼 At the very beginning of the meal
在晚宴的开始 we take a piece of matzah, break it
我们拿出一块无酵饼 掰开 and then one part of that broken matzah
掰开后其中一块无酵饼 is hidden away in an envelope
会藏在一个信封里面 or some zipper compartment or something
或者拉链隔间里面之类的 It is then hidden away
就是要藏起来 Different matzah, different customs here
不同的无酵饼 不同的风俗 about the children hide it
孩子藏起来 and the father has to find it
父亲要找到 Or the father hides it
或者父亲藏起来 the children have to find it
孩子要找到 Whatever, it obviously involves bribery
反正都要涉及到一些贿赂 You give the kids present at the end
最后要给孩子礼物 Not bribery, there's an ugly word
不是贿赂 这是个难听的词 Incentive
是激励 to stay awake, right
让他们有精神嘛 对吧 You give them present
给孩子们礼物 And at the end of the meal
在晚宴的最后 we take out this piece of matzah
拿出这块无酵饼 and we eat it
然后吃掉 That's the last thing we eat
这是我们在逾越节家宴 in the evening of the Seder
那天晚上吃的最后一样东西 is this piece of matzah
就是这块无酵饼 this so-called afiqoman piece of matzah
叫做afiqoman无酵饼 In other words, the afiqoman has now
换句话说 afiqoman现在 become something that we do eat
成了我们要吃的一种东西 The Mishnah says, don't conclude with afiqoman
密西拿说 不要以afiqoman结束 Or the paschal lambs, their ancestors ate
或者是逾越节羔羊 他们的祖先会吃 and we no longer eat
我们已经不吃了 We eat a meal, but we don't eat roast lamb
我们吃晚宴 但是不吃烤羊羔 we eat this piece of matzah
我们吃这块无酵饼 to remind us of the pascal lamb
来纪念逾越节羔羊 that our ancestors used to eat
我们的祖先曾经吃的东西 That's all very intriguing
这些都很有趣 That's the first time we see
第一次我们看到 the word afiqoman and its custom
afiqoman这个词和相关的习俗 we reserving a piece of matzah for the end
我们在最后留下一块无酵饼 called the afiqoman
叫做afiqoman that appears the first time in the 13th century
这是公元13世纪第一次出现 Okay, I mentioned that because
我提到这个是因为 there's some intriguing Christian parallel here
基督教有一些有趣的类似情况 And we may not yet figured out
我们还没有搞清楚 how to disentangle this
如何来解释 Cos what is this piece of matzah, class?
因为这块无酵饼是什么 同学们 The piece of matzah is the symbol
这块无酵饼象征着 of redemption of the paschal lamb
逾越节羔羊的救赎 which is gonna come at the end time
会在最后时刻来临 But it's chosen away, hidden away
不过会在一开始 at the beginning of time
被藏起来 the beginning of the meal, it's hidden
在晚宴开始的时候 会被藏起来 until it comes and it's revealed at the end
直到在最后出现 bring us an efflorescence of deliverance
给我们带来最终的解放 So what is this piece of matzah, class?
所以这块无酵饼是什么 同学们 It's the messiah
这是弥赛亚 and we are eating it
我们吃掉了它 There's something going on here
这里大有学问 There's something going on
这里大有学问 There's some Jewish/Christian
一些犹太教 基督教 something going on here
的问题显露出来了 And of course it's all blown to the radar screen
而且这一切都无迹可寻 There is no text that tells us this
没有文献告诉我们这些 no text will explain it
没有文献做出解释 There's something funny going on here
有一些有趣的东西出现了 the key point here is
关键点是 13th century, not before
公元13世纪 而不是更早 Okay, time's up, thank you all
好了 时间到了 谢谢大家 So next week we'll talk about
下周我们会讲 the Christian side of things
基督教方面的内容 talk about Eucharist and Easter
包括圣餐和复活节 and how the scriptural texts turn into
以及圣经的文本如何演化成了 Christian rituals
基督教的仪式 Thank you, everyone, have a great weekend
谢谢大家 周末愉快 Rhine & trismile Production